Have you ever considered using anabolic steroids?

[jimjohnson]

I thought about TRT but decided against it. Once you start your on for life. Maybe when I’m 60 I will consider it. On a side note, I watched a recent video on YouTube with Drew Baye discussing HIT training. I remember a few years back he stated he was going on TRT. What a difference that made. If you watch one of his old videos then watch a recent one, you will notice that he is much bigger. Even the shape of his face is different. Steroids work no matter what training method you use.

How is face different? Weirdly or in a good way?

I don't particulary want to go bigger...Like i said IF i was older and my natural T level fell and there was no to get it back i might consider HRT but that's the only way i would even consider it. Then i'd make sure i didn't get bigger.

Hopefully if i keep my na. T levels high enough I will never have to.

[Jerb]

Jaw is wider and more square. Traps and shoulders much bigger. Not in a weird way.

---

Jaw is wider and more square.  Traps and shoulders much bigger.  Not in a weird way.

[khrazz]

I thought about TRT but decided against it. Once you start your on for life. Maybe when I’m 60 I will consider it. On a side note, I watched a recent video on YouTube with Drew Baye discussing HIT training. I remember a few years back he stated he was going on TRT. What a difference that made. If you watch one of his old videos then watch a recent one, you will notice that he is much bigger. Even the shape of his face is different. Steroids work no matter what training method you use.

That is what happened to me too after i started TRT. I grew more facial hair and back hair (never had a lot of back hair up until i started TRT) , my voice deepened, and my face also changed a bit in structure.

Its the androgens that cause this . Also my skin is a lot tighter and lost a little bit of bodyfat without me wanting to (typical reaction of your body on anabolics)

As for side effects, apart from severe mood swings (which actually made me switch my TRT protocol from 3 months of injection to once 1 month) and occasional anxiety (this could be caused by ADHD meds but who knows) i have not experienced any side effect that is typically reported by bodybuilders (acne,hair loss etc)

As for muscle gains, to be honest its not  something you easily notice. Well i didnt, up until people started pointing out to me that "wow you are in shape , what workout do you do?" What i observed was that my traps/shoulders/upper chest were kinda fuller than they used to, and that i had some extra energy/agression at the gym .
Agression in particular is a double edged sword because it can make you edgy and quickly pissed off at trivial stuff.

All in all however, the muscle gains were not massive, especially for bodybuilding standards. During the past 9 months i am using TRT, i must have gained around 5-7 kilos (that translates to around 11-15.4 pounds) . Mind you, this was NOT pure muscle gain, and almost 1/3 of that is water gain. Strength gains are OK, and to my observation every injection gives around a 5-10kilo increase in strength and this is compounded with previous injections. This strength is independant to the strength gains you get from training .


BTW, Kudos to TruthSeeker for writing an article about TRT giving you that "wow you workout "look because he was right 100%. That is the case. But its not world changing, TRT alone wont not make you look like Lazar Angelov or Simeon Panda. That is like comparing drinking a shot or 2 of vodka to 1 whole bottle of vodka drunk every night. The poison is in the dose. Always

[jimjohnson]

I thought about TRT but decided against it. Once you start your on for life. Maybe when I’m 60 I will consider it. On a side note, I watched a recent video on YouTube with Drew Baye discussing HIT training. I remember a few years back he stated he was going on TRT. What a difference that made. If you watch one of his old videos then watch a recent one, you will notice that he is much bigger. Even the shape of his face is different. Steroids work no matter what training method you use.

That is what happened to me too after i started TRT. I grew more facial hair and back hair (never had a lot of back hair up until i started TRT) , my voice deepened, and my face also changed a bit in structure.

Its the androgens that cause this . Also my skin is a lot tighter and lost a little bit of bodyfat without me wanting to (typical reaction of your body on anabolics)

As for side effects, apart from severe mood swings (which actually made me switch my TRT protocol from 3 months of injection to once 1 month) and occasional anxiety (this could be caused by ADHD meds but who knows) i have not experienced any side effect that is typically reported by bodybuilders (acne,hair loss etc)

As for muscle gains, to be honest its not  something you easily notice. Well i didnt, up until people started pointing out to me that "wow you are in shape , what workout do you do?" What i observed was that my traps/shoulders/upper chest were kinda fuller than they used to, and that i had some extra energy/agression at the gym .
Agression in particular is a double edged sword because it can make you edgy and quickly pissed off at trivial stuff.

All in all however, the muscle gains were not massive, especially for bodybuilding standards. During the past 9 months i am using TRT, i must have gained around 5-7 kilos (that translates to around 11-15.4 pounds) . Mind you, this was NOT pure muscle gain, and almost 1/3 of that is water gain. Strength gains are OK, and to my observation every injection gives around a 5-10kilo increase in strength and this is compounded with previous injections. This strength is independant to the strength gains you get from training .


BTW, Kudos to TruthSeeker for writing an article about TRT giving you that "wow you workout "look because he was right 100%. That is the case. But its not world changing,  TRT alone wont not make you look like Lazar Angelov or Simeon Panda. That is like comparing drinking a shot or 2 of vodka to 1 whole bottle of vodka drunk every night. The poison is in the dose. Always

No i never thought it would transform you into Arnie overnight but those gains you say are gains you could never get from just hitting the gym more and hence why people do it.

I mean a ripped 74kg guy that lifts would look completely different ripped and 80kg.

How old are you by the way? Are you on TRT for life now? I guess your natural is dead?

---

There have been tests done where people that took Test. and did no weight lifting still put on more muscle than a guy that lifted weights 3x weeks.

So when people say daft things like "It made no difference they still had to put in the work...they are talking horse crap as per normal. It' makes a huge difference without any effort.

I wonder if in like 50 years time everyone over the age of 40 will be on this stuff? The human physique is for ever evolving i wonder if being lean and muscely (chemically of course) will be the new normal?

Or we will go like those huge bloated fat ****'s you see in my 600lb life? Real life Walley..?

[khrazz]

How old are you by the way? Are you on TRT for life now? I guess your natural is dead?

---

There have been tests done where people that took Test. and did no weight lifting still put on more muscle than a guy that lifted weights 3x weeks.

So when people say daft things like "It made no difference they still had to put in the work...they are talking horse crap as per normal. It' makes a huge difference without any effort.

I wonder if in like 50 years time everyone over the age of 40 will be on this stuff? The human physique is for ever evolving i wonder if being lean and muscely (chemically of course) will be the new normal?

Or we will go like those huge bloated fat ****'s you see in my 600lb life? Real life Walley..?

I am 25 . I started TRT because due to multiple sclerosis i suffered a lot of side effects from both meds and MS itself. One particularly, was erectile dysfunction,and it was something that i was suffering since i was 18 years old (but back then it was not as severe - and ofcourse i did not know i had MS so i always brushed it off as something that "just happened". While on the subject of erectile dysfunction, TRT does NOT completely eradicate the problem. It just decreases its frequency . Also it makes me a lot more interested in sex, because without it, i am like "fuck she wants sex again? give me a break wtf" Which is something REALLY embarrasing and bad, considering i am very young and i should NOT think that way (and no, i am not talking about being a pornstar, but acting like people my age .

While my bloodwork is fine, my test levels are close to 300 (always been, even before TRT) and past TRT my test levels are again close to 300-350ish. 

And yes, you still have to put in the work. If you dont, you wont get jackshit of results. Its when you go to superphysiological levels that training matters less and less (dosages of arnold,ronnie coleman, kai greene etc).
Also there is a huge difference between doctor TRT and bodybuilding TRT. Here is a video of a guy explaining it very well
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ucwZMjlUr2U


Basically a lot of bodybuilders claim to be on TRT, yet all they do is blast gear along with "TRT". Thats not TRT. Thats just blasting gear while using doctor approved test.

And you could say that i get a prescription to use anabolic steroids, since i have no hormonal issue, well that may be the case, but tbh i care more for being healthy and having energy to enjoy life than about thinking trivial stuff like if i am natural or if " i cheat the system". To me, nature wants me dead. So me being alive is already unatural

[jimjohnson]

300-350 is still quite low though isn't it? Isn't normal about 700? Top being about 900? Why not up it to at least high range of normal? That can't be bad for you?

[khrazz]

300-350 is still quite low though isn't it? Isn't normal about 700? Top being about 900? Why not up it to at least high range of normal? That can't be bad for you?

Yes it is low, but since the range is 220-870 modern science considers that range "normal" to have, even though such range is  perfect for a 50-60 year old man but for a 25 year old like me its rubish. The most i have ever been was like in the 400 range, and that was past a testosterone injection. So go figure.


Here is the thing with many auto-immune diseases. They cause damage to your body, and can mimic certain disorders symptom wise, without you having those disorders however. This can make it difficult to find those auto-immune diseases because you experience a symptom (for example, symptoms of low testosterone) by not really having low testosterone. After paying a visit to your doctor, your doctor finds to perfect and sends you home, even though you are suffering inside. This is called The great imitator (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_great_imitator) and it can be a great pain to eventually find an answer to your problem.

When i was in my early 20s, i noticed a very high degree of ED (erectile dysfunction) but whoever i was talking to always said that i was just tired, that i should ease into my gym training, sleep better ... you know the classic advice. Ofcourse, i knew that this was not the case, so i started searching on google . Before long, i found various sites that blamed low T for ED, so i made an appointment for hormonal bloodwork. The results reveled (back then) that i had about 500ish T levels, and my doctor said "you should be walking with a boner"

Well obviously that was not the case, and the result dissapointed me even further cause i found no solution to my problem. And obviously, no doctor would give me testosterone. Its only after my diagnosis that endocrinologists are less reluctant to hormonal prescription - and even then they dont do it easily cause my hormones are "normal" and they could easily get into trouble with the greek DEA (mind you, Greece is notorious for its black market anabolic steroid scandals, 20 years ago you could walk into a pharmacy and buy quality steroids without even having a doctors prescription - go figure )

[Jonesy]

I thought about TRT but decided against it. Once you start your on for life. Maybe when I’m 60 I will consider it. On a side note, I watched a recent video on YouTube with Drew Baye discussing HIT training. I remember a few years back he stated he was going on TRT. What a difference that made. If you watch one of his old videos then watch a recent one, you will notice that he is much bigger. Even the shape of his face is different. Steroids work no matter what training method you use.

That is what happened to me too after i started TRT. I grew more facial hair and back hair (never had a lot of back hair up until i started TRT) , my voice deepened, and my face also changed a bit in structure.

Its the androgens that cause this . Also my skin is a lot tighter and lost a little bit of bodyfat without me wanting to (typical reaction of your body on anabolics)

As for side effects, apart from severe mood swings (which actually made me switch my TRT protocol from 3 months of injection to once 1 month) and occasional anxiety (this could be caused by ADHD meds but who knows) i have not experienced any side effect that is typically reported by bodybuilders (acne,hair loss etc)

As for muscle gains, to be honest its not  something you easily notice. Well i didnt, up until people started pointing out to me that "wow you are in shape , what workout do you do?" What i observed was that my traps/shoulders/upper chest were kinda fuller than they used to, and that i had some extra energy/agression at the gym .
Agression in particular is a double edged sword because it can make you edgy and quickly pissed off at trivial stuff.

All in all however, the muscle gains were not massive, especially for bodybuilding standards. During the past 9 months i am using TRT, i must have gained around 5-7 kilos (that translates to around 11-15.4 pounds) . Mind you, this was NOT pure muscle gain, and almost 1/3 of that is water gain. Strength gains are OK, and to my observation every injection gives around a 5-10kilo increase in strength and this is compounded with previous injections. This strength is independant to the strength gains you get from training .


BTW, Kudos to TruthSeeker for writing an article about TRT giving you that "wow you workout "look because he was right 100%. That is the case. But its not world changing,  TRT alone wont not make you look like Lazar Angelov or Simeon Panda. That is like comparing drinking a shot or 2 of vodka to 1 whole bottle of vodka drunk every night. The poison is in the dose. Always

One thing I will add is that ADHD meds do indeed give you crippling anxiety, especially if the dose is high. Are you still taking them and do you find them a good thing?


BTW - Are you Greek then? Your written English is excellent.

[khrazz]

One thing I will add is that ADHD meds do indeed give you crippling anxiety, especially if the dose is high. Are you still taking them and do you find them a good thing?


BTW - Are you Greek then? Your written English is excellent.

Yes i still take them. Unfortunately i am in a cocktail of drugs, in order to fight of either the side effects from the drugs i take for MS , or for the side effects MS itself causes ( extreme fatigue, depressive mood,constipation ... the list goes on)

My dose is not extremely high, because those meds can give you anxiety and insomnia, plus they stop working that well once you pass a certain threshold of dosage. The only time i up my dose a lot is during exam season, or during powerlifting competition, because i want myself to be at 110% and not be suboptimal. And the funny thing is, MS itself causes insomnia, so its more like insomnia from MS + insomnia from stimulants. Its crazy i am telling you haha

They are a great thing, because those drugs give you both energy and focus.  They are perfect for people who have ADHD, low energy and daytime sleepiness . However you need to make great caution because those drugs are very powerful and can easily give you jitters, anxiety, nervousness and aggresion, which is something that is caused by the "extra energy" awarded by those meds. One thing i found out is that to  combat anxiety/nervousness/restlessness is to just get moving the moment you take them. So, working out while taking those drugs is one way i  found out to combat the side effects. :


And yes, i am Greek. Thanks for your comment on my written English. : I do the best i can ! This is years of self teaching/audio processing (being dyslexic, audio processing is a great way for me to learn)

[Jonesy]

I am on ADHD meds too, so I know what you mean. I am supposed to be on 60mg of dexamfetamine a day (a high dose). Been diagnosed six years now. I have had some mad experiences over the years due to going without sleep. One thing I found the meds go well with is video games lol. I would play skyrim or dark souls all night and get really into the game. The meds do have side effects though yeah. Like you miss the bigger picture and focus on minor details too much. But I have abused the meds irresponsibly in the past to stay up gaming. They also make me really horny which is weird, so I have had some epic porn and masturbation marathons on adhd meds lol.