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A Desert in the Sky discussion
#1
I finished the book this morning after increasingly non-stop reading.

Harry

Reflecting on him a bit, Harry strikes me as a Gollum-like character. He is torn between peace and war internally and externally. By the point we are let into his life, Harry is increasingly using his own cynicism to justify and rationalize what could be interpreted as committing aggressive "war crimes" externally, rather than Geneva-approved acts. He has begun committing what he condemns, or would condemn if it was done to him. But whereas Gollum was first driven to that by stumbling on something he was not aware of before and now wishes to keep, Harry is driven to it by what he was always looking for and is intensely aware that he misses. Gollum has "forgotten the taste of bread" and "the softness of the wind" whereas Harry is tortured by his spots of remembrance of tasting and touching a woman. Both of them are recluses, "bugs in the system" that do not socialize evenly with others. They are both increasingly deranged by the fear, hate and despair they experience in and outside of themselves. We are told that, as Gollum used to be Smeagol, Harry did not always use to feel the aggressive way he now increasingly does.

It pained me to read many things that Harry went through and noted, because they struck me as so familiar. One of those notations brings me to another point. Harry rages against the conformity of the system. But maybe part of that conformity is the marketing and belief that we are all supposed to be unique? There are billions of people in the world, all sharing the same basic genetics and environments. They have the same basic needs and desires for food, shelter, sex, affection, health and selfesteem. How many ways are there to be "unique"? is it intrinsically satisfying, or is it the system saying that you should find it so? if happiness or any achievement is made out to be a relative value requiring others to be less than you, rather than an intrinsic absolute value, aren't we choosing to create a perpetual lack, a forever futile zero sum rat race?

The narcissistic treatment Harry experiences from those he wants to make it work with reflects my own experience the one time I did let my own hands go of my course and exposed myself to fate. When it came time for action she did a 180 turn and treated me like a chewing gum she'd spit out and now found stuck on her shoe. I was dismissed and disregarded, despite my evident sincerity and the small intimacy and history we'd already shared. This was not a girl who you would see on the outside and think that she was obvious trouble, and I was a fool, either. The worst may or may not be that I actually expected it to go wrong. I had just not anticipated the precise magnitude of it - but for all my hurt, I could not feel too disappointed, because I had not been surprised. How many public social justice warriors have privately crushed sincere men with no remorse and toy with them for a hobby?

Yet sometimes Harry notes the presence of men who are seemingly not too much unlike himself, accompanied by women Harry may himself desire, who at least seem to desire that man. Is it a trick of Harry's perception, and he does not know it is merely their own episode with a giraffe? Is it a proof that Harry is a maladaptive organism, an error in the code? Or is it the system mocking him with its survivor bias to his face?
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#2
I love this so far not to be rude but it kind not making my life so bad,because harry seem to have the worst luck. man if girls treated me like that I would gone so mad . guess my experience has not been as bad which ikind makes me happy. but I feel for ya bro . I liked how the girl said no kissing on first date then replied it was not a date. women cant take her own Reasonability.

then again I am still young yet ! some I relate tooo but on more innocent level.
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#3
(11-04-2019, 01:04 PM)Loverboy Wrote: I finished the book this morning after increasingly non-stop reading.

Harry

Reflecting on him a bit, Harry strikes me as a Gollum-like character. He is torn between peace and war internally and externally. By the point we are let into his life, Harry is increasingly using his own cynicism to justify and rationalize what could be interpreted as committing aggressive "war crimes" externally, rather than Geneva-approved acts. He has begun committing what he condemns, or would condemn if it was done to him. But whereas Gollum was first driven to that by stumbling on something he was not aware of before and now wishes to keep, Harry is driven to it by what he was always looking for and is intensely aware that he misses. Gollum has "forgotten the taste of bread" and "the softness of the wind" whereas Harry is tortured by his spots of remembrance of tasting and touching a woman. Both of them are recluses, "bugs in the system" that do not socialize evenly with others. They are both increasingly deranged by the fear, hate and despair they experience in and outside of themselves. We are told that, as Gollum used to be Smeagol, Harry did not always use to feel the aggressive way he now increasingly does.

It pained me to read many things that Harry went through and noted, because they struck me as so familiar. One of those notations brings me to another point. Harry rages against the conformity of the system. But maybe part of that conformity is the marketing and belief that we are all supposed to be unique? There are billions of people in the world, all sharing the same basic genetics and environments. They have the same basic needs and desires for food, shelter, sex, affection, health and selfesteem. How many ways are there to be "unique"? is it intrinsically satisfying, or is it the system saying that you should find it so? if happiness or any achievement is made out to be a relative value requiring others to be less than you, rather than an intrinsic absolute value, aren't we choosing to create a perpetual lack, a forever futile zero sum rat race?

The narcissistic treatment Harry experiences from those he wants to make it work with reflects my own experience the one time I did let my own hands go of my course and exposed myself to fate. When it came time for action she did a 180 turn and treated me like a chewing gum she'd spit out and now found stuck on her shoe. I was dismissed and disregarded, despite my evident sincerity and the small intimacy and history we'd already shared. This was not a girl who you would see on the outside and think that she was obvious trouble, and I was a fool, either. The worst may or may not be that I actually expected it to go wrong. I had just not anticipated the precise magnitude of it - but for all my hurt, I could not feel too disappointed, because I had not been surprised. How many public social justice warriors have privately crushed sincere men with no remorse and toy with them for a hobby?

Yet sometimes Harry notes the presence of men who are seemingly not too much unlike himself, accompanied by women Harry may himself desire, who at least seem to desire that man. Is it a trick of Harry's perception, and he does not know it is merely their own episode with a giraffe? Is it a proof that Harry is a maladaptive organism, an error in the code? Or is it the system mocking him with its survivor bias to his face?

I really appreciate your analysis and effort to write it.

I know that many men will find themselves in Harry because the behavior that he receives is a product of the current environment. Obviously, it's a fiction book, but 90% of the love stories are indeed real. The one that hurt the most was "The Actress".

Thank you for supporting me!

"Is it a trick of Harry's perception, and he does not know it is merely their own episode with a giraffe?" - I really like that sentence by the way. It is perfect. Never thought of it that way.

(11-04-2019, 02:29 PM)Plato Wrote: I love this so far not to be rude but it kind not making my life so bad,because harry seem to have the worst luck.  man if girls treated me like that I would gone so mad . guess my experience has not been as bad which ikind makes me happy. but I feel for ya bro . I liked how the girl said no kissing on first date then replied it was not a date.  women cant take her own Reasonability.  

then again I am still young yet ! some I relate tooo but on more innocent level.

She really did say that.  Thanks for the support.
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#4
Rereading the book, and getting to the part between Rosalinda and "Nico", just makes me resigned to speechlessness. I wish every man on Earth would read this segment and the preceding background for it. I honestly find it hard to continue reading the last of the episode between Rosalinda and Nico, and the specific line where that happens is when she asks why all handsome men are so rude. At that line in that context, I smile sighingly as I am made speechless by the tragicomedy.

For me this is an emotional high point of the book so far. Harry is faced viscerally with the indisputable contrast between his reality and the reality of a male preselected winner - and the wordless hatred, suffering and cosmic tragicomedy of the situation that he feels comes alive in you too. It is here that Harry is faced with his greater reality as a cosmic clown who will be either ignored or pointed and laughed at and lives by begging and scavenging, witnessing the contrast between his life and the male genetic aristocracy. He is led to the fork in the road between existential defeat and despondent acceptance of his impotence, or existential rage and mad rebellion.

Seeing the contrast between the cosmic clowns and the genetic aristocracy is the most existentially nourishing part. I only want to see more of it, I wish I would see it more myself in my own life too.
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#5
"Cosmic clowns" and "genetic aristocracy" are very creative and brutally honest terms. And even though that book is fiction, we all know that this exchange is very real and happens all the time. If she's not texting you, she's either texting no one or guys like Nico.

I have certainly felt like a "cosmic clown" on many occasions upon getting rejected. As expected, it hurt the most at first. Then you develop scars. It still hurts, but the edge of the pain is taken away. You feel sad, but the sadness is kinda dull even though it's still pretty deep.
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